Socialism at it's very best.
Tags: Solidarity, Upstarts, Angelic
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You are litterally saying that all of what Marx wrote is not what Marx wanted. You honestly are just attempting to further demonize Marx without any support for any of your suppositions. If this is all you have to offer as a counter to my statements, then I consider this conversation fruitless, and therefore, over.
He is the ultimate authoriatarian, the ‘last face of his paradise’ (if i can call it that) is a minor thing in his theory, if anything it is just used to draw more support, it was of minor importance. As i see it by focussing on this so called passing face, he was clear that this was exatly what he want. And again the first international splitted because of marx his authotarianism!
That isn’t really the point. You said Marx was the ultimate authoritarian. I said that Marx’s end goal was the exact opposite of authoritarian. If anything, Marx just has too much confidence in his fellow man. It is true that once a person has power it is highly unlikely that they will ever relinquish that power.
I know what marx so called end goal was, the problem is that you will never get their, He thougth tis ‘dictatorship’ would just a some moment seize to exrist out of its one, this is stupid. Once there is a government with power it will keep on justifying its own existence because it doesn’t want to lose its power, power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely
Bakunin wanted an immediate dissolution of the state, because he feared that the dictatorship of the proletariat would in fact lead to a permenant proletariat dictatorship. If you are saying that this was the prediction, about Bakunin made, then you are correct. However, where Marx and Bakunin varied in execution of revolution and the time after the revolution, their end goals were rather similar.
I think you may be confusing some of Bakunin’s statements. Really, both social anarchists (which of course Bakunin was) and Marxists essentially sought the same conclusion: an egalitarian society free of government and class. Bakunin’s major disagreement came from Marx’s theory that after revolution, a dictatorship of the proletariat would be required in the trainsition from capitalist to the egalitarian, stateless and governmentless soceity.
haha, Marx and anarchism? Marx was always an ultimate authoriatarian, why do you think the first internationale splitted? Bakunin even said already then that if Marx ideas were ever to be reality it would be brutal dictaorship, i think his predictions were pretty accurate…
but is is
Okay, I got what youre saying
I’m not sure if he technically says no rulers, but he does speak of getting rid of the state, and everyone making decisions for their community completely democratically. I completely agree this is not a traditional form of anarchism, which is why I had previously stated that communism is a mix of anarchism and socialism. It isn’t completely either, especially not in the strictest sense.
Anarchism would also include the abolishment of any form of coersion, which Communism has. Also, where does Marx mention “no rulers”?
Marx believed that his version of communism would require the dissolution of the state to a point where there would be no rulers, which is the definition of anarchism. Every decision would be made truly democratically (with every person having a vote), and of course private property would be abolished and would only belon to the community. My use of anarchism was refering to the lack of an actual state, and social class.
You are right
“Communism would be a mix of anarchism…”
You don`t seem to know what the fuck you are talking about
Well, fascism and a strong socialism is essentially what Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot. Communism would be a mix of anarchism and the most extreme socialism possible. Marx believed in the dissolution of the state, while those leaders, after gaining power, refused to weaken their state.
You’re an ignorant idiot. Communism is based in equality, whereas nazism is based on hate and prejudice. People like Mao, Stalin, and Pol Pot were not communist, but people who abused the power communism can create. They were facsist if anything
This song was written in the beginning of the 1980´s….and is dedicated for solidarnosc!!!!!!!!!
SCUMHEAD and RED NAZI!!!!!
@sovietmarxist
as the polish workers fight to make their stand
and behind them every honest working men
join hand with your brother and then you can help each other
watch the tyrant burn in the fire that he had built.
@sovietmarxist
give them hope, give them strength, give them live
like a candle burning in the black of night
we`re all with you in our hearts and in our minds
and we`ll pray for our nation through its darkest times
This must be one of the most underrated punk songs of all time.
Great melody, great lyrics and a fucking great band.
what’s that song at the end?
@ByzanzRebel
lol, so the equality of all people is the same as the equality of the few?
you’re so wrong.
In the GDR punks were defamed as Nazis and came to the Secret Service prison
In Cuba punks came to the prison
Go on sleeping and believe in your imagination island
Dear people
You can value me badly
but you cannot change the reality.
Commies or Nazis ARE the same!
Solidanorc